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    The Manifesto of Joe Stacks (IRS BUILDING PLANE CRASH DUDE)

    Percy
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    Post by Percy Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:14 pm

    Man Crashes plane in to IRS building, here is his MANIFESTO that he wrote just before he went on his suicide mission:


    If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?” The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time. The writing process, started many months ago, was intended to be therapy in the face of the looming realization that there isn’t enough therapy in the world that can fix what is really broken. Needless to say, this rant could fill volumes with example after example if I would let it. I find the process of writing it frustrating, tedious, and probably pointless… especially given my gross inability to gracefully articulate my thoughts in light of the storm raging in my head. Exactly what is therapeutic about that I’m not sure, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

    We are all taught as children that without laws there would be no society, only anarchy. Sadly, starting at early ages we in this country have been brainwashed to believe that, in return for our dedication and service, our government stands for justice for all. We are further brainwashed to believe that there is freedom in this place, and that we should be ready to lay our lives down for the noble principals represented by its founding fathers. Remember? One of these was “no taxation without representation”. I have spent the total years of my adulthood unlearning that crap from only a few years of my childhood. These days anyone who really stands up for that principal is promptly labeled a “crackpot”, traitor and worse.

    While very few working people would say they haven’t had their fair share of taxes (as can I), in my lifetime I can say with a great degree of certainty that there has never been a politician cast a vote on any matter with the likes of me or my interests in mind. Nor, for that matter, are they the least bit interested in me or anything I have to say.

    Why is it that a handful of thugs and plunderers can commit unthinkable atrocities (and in the case of the GM executives, for scores of years) and when it’s time for their gravy train to crash under the weight of their gluttony and overwhelming stupidity, the force of the full federal government has no difficulty coming to their aid within days if not hours? Yet at the same time, the joke we call the American medical system, including the drug and insurance companies, are murdering tens of thousands of people a year and stealing from the corpses and victims they cripple, and this country’s leaders don’t see this as important as bailing out a few of their vile, rich cronies. Yet, the political “representatives” (thieves, liars, and self-serving scumbags is far more accurate) have endless time to sit around for year after year and debate the state of the “terrible health care problem”. It’s clear they see no crisis as long as the dead people don’t get in the way of their corporate profits rolling in.

    And justice? You’ve got to be kidding!

    How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand. Yet, it mercilessly “holds accountable” its victims, claiming that they’re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand. The law “requires” a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if that’s not “duress” than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is.

    How did I get here?

    My introduction to the real American nightmare starts back in the early ‘80s. Unfortunately after more than 16 years of school, somewhere along the line I picked up the absurd, pompous notion that I could read and understand plain English. Some friends introduced me to a group of people who were having ‘tax code’ readings and discussions. In particular, zeroed in on a section relating to the wonderful “exemptions” that make institutions like the vulgar, corrupt Catholic Church so incredibly wealthy. We carefully studied the law (with the help of some of the “best”, high-paid, experienced tax lawyers in the business), and then began to do exactly what the “big boys” were doing (except that we weren’t steeling from our congregation or lying to the government about our massive profits in the name of God). We took a great deal of care to make it all visible, following all of the rules, exactly the way the law said it was to be done.

    The intent of this exercise and our efforts was to bring about a much-needed re-evaluation of the laws that allow the monsters of organized religion to make such a mockery of people who earn an honest living. However, this is where I learned that there are two “interpretations” for every law; one for the very rich, and one for the rest of us… Oh, and the monsters are the very ones making and enforcing the laws; the inquisition is still alive and well today in this country.

    That little lesson in patriotism cost me $40,000+, 10 years of my life, and set my retirement plans back to 0. It made me realize for the first time that I live in a country with an ideology that is based on a total and complete lie. It also made me realize, not only how naive I had been, but also the incredible stupidity of the American public; that they buy, hook, line, and sinker, the crap about their “freedom”… and that they continue to do so with eyes closed in the face of overwhelming evidence and all that keeps happening in front of them.

    Before even having to make a shaky recovery from the sting of the first lesson on what justice really means in this country (around 1984 after making my way through engineering school and still another five years of “paying my dues”), I felt I finally had to take a chance of launching my dream of becoming an independent engineer.

    On the subjects of engineers and dreams of independence, I should digress somewhat to say that I’m sure that I inherited the fascination for creative problem solving from my father. I realized this at a very young age.

    The significance of independence, however, came much later during my early years of college; at the age of 18 or 19 when I was living on my own as student in an apartment in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. My neighbor was an elderly retired woman (80+ seemed ancient to me at that age) who was the widowed wife of a retired steel worker. Her husband had worked all his life in the steel mills of central Pennsylvania with promises from big business and the union that, for his 30 years of service, he would have a pension and medical care to look forward to in his retirement. Instead he was one of the thousands who got nothing because the incompetent mill management and corrupt union (not to mention the government) raided their pension funds and stole their retirement. All she had was social security to live on.

    In retrospect, the situation was laughable because here I was living on peanut butter and bread (or Ritz crackers when I could afford to splurge) for months at a time. When I got to know this poor figure and heard her story I felt worse for her plight than for my own (I, after all, I thought I had everything to in front of me). I was genuinely appalled at one point, as we exchanged stories and commiserated with each other over our situations, when she in her grandmotherly fashion tried to convince me that I would be “healthier” eating cat food (like her) rather than trying to get all my substance from peanut butter and bread. I couldn’t quite go there, but the impression was made. I decided that I didn’t trust big business to take care of me, and that I would take responsibility for my own future and myself.

    Return to the early ‘80s, and here I was off to a terrifying start as a ‘wet-behind-the-ears’ contract software engineer… and two years later, thanks to the fine backroom, midnight effort by the sleazy executives of Arthur Andersen (the very same folks who later brought us Enron and other such calamities) and an equally sleazy New York Senator (Patrick Moynihan), we saw the passage of 1986 tax reform act with its section 1706.

    For you who are unfamiliar, here is the core text of the IRS Section 1706, defining the treatment of workers (such as contract engineers) for tax purposes. Visit this link for a conference committee report (http://www.synergistech.com/1706.shtml#ConferenceCommitteeReport) regarding the intended interpretation of Section 1706 and the relevant parts of Section 530, as amended. For information on how these laws affect technical services workers and their clients, read our discussion here (http://www.synergistech.com/ic-taxlaw.shtml).

    SEC. 1706. TREATMENT OF CERTAIN TECHNICAL PERSONNEL.

    (a) IN GENERAL – Section 530 of the Revenue Act of 1978 is amended by adding at the end thereof the following new subsection:

    (d) EXCEPTION. – This section shall not apply in the case of an individual who pursuant to an arrangement between the taxpayer and another person, provides services for such other person as an engineer, designer, drafter, computer programmer, systems analyst, or other similarly skilled worker engaged in a similar line of work.

    (b) EFFECTIVE DATE. – The amendment made by this section shall apply to remuneration paid and services rendered after December 31, 1986.

    Note:

    · “another person” is the client in the traditional job-shop relationship.

    · “taxpayer” is the recruiter, broker, agency, or job shop.

    · “individual”, “employee”, or “worker” is you.



    Admittedly, you need to read the treatment to understand what it is saying but it’s not very complicated. The bottom line is that they may as well have put my name right in the text of section (d). Moreover, they could only have been more blunt if they would have came out and directly declared me a criminal and non-citizen slave. Twenty years later, I still can’t believe my eyes.

    During 1987, I spent close to $5000 of my ‘pocket change’, and at least 1000 hours of my time writing, printing, and mailing to any senator, congressman, governor, or slug that might listen; none did, and they universally treated me as if I was wasting their time. I spent countless hours on the L.A. freeways driving to meetings and any and all of the disorganized professional groups who were attempting to mount a campaign against this atrocity. This, only to discover that our efforts were being easily derailed by a few moles from the brokers who were just beginning to enjoy the windfall from the new declaration of their “freedom”. Oh, and don’t forget, for all of the time I was spending on this, I was loosing income that I couldn’t bill clients.

    After months of struggling it had clearly gotten to be a futile exercise. The best we could get for all of our trouble is a pronouncement from an IRS mouthpiece that they weren’t going to enforce that provision (read harass engineers and scientists). This immediately proved to be a lie, and the mere existence of the regulation began to have its impact on my bottom line; this, of course, was the intended effect.

    Again, rewind my retirement plans back to 0 and shift them into idle. If I had any sense, I clearly should have left abandoned engineering and never looked back.

    Instead I got busy working 100-hour workweeks. Then came the L.A. depression of the early 1990s. Our leaders decided that they didn’t need the all of those extra Air Force bases they had in Southern California, so they were closed; just like that. The result was economic devastation in the region that rivaled the widely publicized Texas S&L fiasco. However, because the government caused it, no one gave a shit about all of the young families who lost their homes or street after street of boarded up houses abandoned to the wealthy loan companies who received government funds to “shore up” their windfall. Again, I lost my retirement.

    Years later, after weathering a divorce and the constant struggle trying to build some momentum with my business, I find myself once again beginning to finally pick up some speed. Then came the .COM bust and the 911 nightmare. Our leaders decided that all aircraft were grounded for what seemed like an eternity; and long after that, ‘special’ facilities like San Francisco were on security alert for months. This made access to my customers prohibitively expensive. Ironically, after what they had done the Government came to the aid of the airlines with billions of our tax dollars … as usual they left me to rot and die while they bailed out their rich, incompetent cronies WITH MY MONEY! After these events, there went my business but not quite yet all of my retirement and savings.

    By this time, I’m thinking that it might be good for a change. Bye to California, I’ll try Austin for a while. So I moved, only to find out that this is a place with a highly inflated sense of self-importance and where damn little real engineering work is done. I’ve never experienced such a hard time finding work. The rates are 1/3 of what I was earning before the crash, because pay rates here are fixed by the three or four large companies in the area who are in collusion to drive down prices and wages… and this happens because the justice department is all on the take and doesn’t give a fuck about serving anyone or anything but themselves and their rich buddies.

    To survive, I was forced to cannibalize my savings and retirement, the last of which was a small IRA. This came in a year with mammoth expenses and not a single dollar of income. I filed no return that year thinking that because I didn’t have any income there was no need. The sleazy government decided that they disagreed. But they didn’t notify me in time for me to launch a legal objection so when I attempted to get a protest filed with the court I was told I was no longer entitled to due process because the time to file ran out. Bend over for another $10,000 helping of justice.

    So now we come to the present. After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again. But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle. After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.

    When we received the forms back I was very optimistic that they were in order. I had taken all of the years information to Bill Ross, and he came back with results very similar to what I was expecting. Except that he had neglected to include the contents of Sheryl’s unreported income; $12,700 worth of it. To make matters worse, Ross knew all along this was missing and I didn’t have a clue until he pointed it out in the middle of the audit. By that time it had become brutally evident that he was representing himself and not me.

    This left me stuck in the middle of this disaster trying to defend transactions that have no relationship to anything tax-related (at least the tax-related transactions were poorly documented). Things I never knew anything about and things my wife had no clue would ever matter to anyone. The end result is… well, just look around.

    I remember reading about the stock market crash before the “great” depression and how there were wealthy bankers and businessmen jumping out of windows when they realized they screwed up and lost everything. Isn’t it ironic how far we’ve come in 60 years in this country that they now know how to fix that little economic problem; they just steal from the middle class (who doesn’t have any say in it, elections are a joke) to cover their asses and it’s “business-as-usual”. Now when the wealthy fuck up, the poor get to die for the mistakes… isn’t that a clever, tidy solution.

    As government agencies go, the FAA is often justifiably referred to as a tombstone agency, though they are hardly alone. The recent presidential puppet GW Bush and his cronies in their eight years certainly reinforced for all of us that this criticism rings equally true for all of the government. Nothing changes unless there is a body count (unless it is in the interest of the wealthy sows at the government trough). In a government full of hypocrites from top to bottom, life is as cheap as their lies and their self-serving laws.

    I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

    I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of shit at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along.

    I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let’s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.

    http://www.truthinourtime.com/2010/02/joe-stacks-manifesto.html


    Last edited by Paximus on Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:31 pm; edited 4 times in total
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    Post by ericclimbs Thu Feb 18, 2010 2:56 pm

    That guy (Joseph Stack) who crashed into the IRS building in Texas did it for political reasons.

    Here is his suicide note:

    http://embeddedart.com/
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    Post by Guest Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:45 pm

    ericclimbs wrote:That guy (Joseph Stack) who crashed into the IRS building in Texas did it for political reasons.

    Here is his suicide note:

    http://embeddedart.com/

    He did kill his family too? I've read conflicting reports -- that they were saved from their burning home or that he killed his wife, daughter and cat.
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    Post by Percy Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:50 pm

    The Kay wrote:
    ericclimbs wrote:That guy (Joseph Stack) who crashed into the IRS building in Texas did it for political reasons.

    Here is his suicide note:

    http://embeddedart.com/

    He did kill his family too? I've read conflicting reports -- that they were saved from their burning home or that he killed his wife, daughter and cat.

    Fucker. I love cats.
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    Post by ericclimbs Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:31 pm

    It seems the Wife and kid were saved. As for any cats I have not heard. No reports on if anyone in the building killed. By now you'd think we'd have heard about that so hopefully he didn't end up killing anyone.

    I love cats too.

    Going to meditate on your avatar now. . .


    Last edited by ericclimbs on Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post by Percy Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:32 pm

    A QABALISTIC INTERPRETATION OF
    Dr. Seuss' GREEN EGGS AND HAM

    http://www.excludedmiddle.com/occulted_dr._seuss.htm
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    Post by wadahoot Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:55 am

    The wife gave (at least) one interview in which she said that she 'knew' he was ready to blow. She is now being sued by the family of the IRS employee that he killed with the plane crash. Frankly, I don't blame them, but OTOH, I'm hopeful that she didn't know he would do THAT!
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    Post by Percy Thu Feb 25, 2010 4:10 am

    AGREED, that would be hard to prove in court. Cant easily prove what a person is thinking.
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    Post by blouAngel Thu Feb 25, 2010 4:13 am

    Paximus wrote:AGREED, that would be hard to prove in court. Cant easily prove what a person is thinking.

    With a lot of people, it's nearly impossible to prove that they are capable of thinking.
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    Post by Percy Thu Feb 25, 2010 4:17 am

    blouAngel wrote:
    Paximus wrote:AGREED, that would be hard to prove in court. Cant easily prove what a person is thinking.

    With a lot of people, it's nearly impossible to prove that they are capable of thinking.

    Ha, aint that the truth.
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    Post by Percy Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:30 pm

    Did you guys read his manifesto?
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    Post by Guest Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:53 pm

    Paximus wrote:Did you guys read his manifesto?


    Yes. He did not like the way the tax laws worked. He tried something, it failed and he was penalized. He should have tried other efforts to focus on getting the laws changed, not kill an innocent man and risks lives of others.
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    Post by ziggy Fri Feb 26, 2010 5:13 am

    I read every word of it. I think he was being discredited when his writing was described as rambings and delusional. He was actually intelligent and cogent. I will have to comment very lightly on this because I have known people very deep into the anti-tax underground and also ex-IRS.

    It is criminal that we must abide by a tax code that no one can understand and that this "administrative agency" has complete power, the power to declare someone guilty immediately and shift the burden of proof to prove innocence to the accused. That goes against our system and our foundation of fairness and justice. "Administrative agencies" have absolute power and what do they say about absolute power? Yup.
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    Post by Percy Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:21 pm

    ziggy wrote:I read every word of it. I think he was being discredited when his writing was described as rambings and delusional. He was actually intelligent and cogent. I will have to comment very lightly on this because I have known people very deep into the anti-tax underground and also ex-IRS.

    It is criminal that we must abide by a tax code that no one can understand and that this "administrative agency" has complete power, the power to declare someone guilty immediately and shift the burden of proof to prove innocence to the accused. That goes against our system and our foundation of fairness and justice. "Administrative agencies" have absolute power and what do they say about absolute power? Yup.


    Good points. I really dont have any objections to paying my share of taxes. I DO object to my tax money being used to wage wars that have nothing to do with the protection of the homeland.

    That said, violence is never ok and although I can understand where Mr Stack is coming from I have to think he could have handled this a better way. Some people are calling him a patriot but I doubt the family of the killed innocent victim who had nothing to do with Mr Stacks problems feel that way.


    Last edited by Paximus on Fri Feb 26, 2010 7:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post by ziggy Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:59 pm

    Then again, when you work for the IRS are you complicit with the corruption and anti-founding fathers' ideals and get to use the excuse..."I'm just doing my job?" When have we heard that excuse before?

    I think until we can reign in our politicians, we should have a checklist on our tax returns of all uses of taxpayer dollars so we can allocate where we'd like our money to go!

    Can you imagine how long the list would be of government programs to choose from? It would certainly be more fair and a HUGE wake up call to Americans.
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    Post by Percy Fri Feb 26, 2010 7:36 pm

    ziggy wrote:Then again, when you work for the IRS are you complicit with the corruption and anti-founding fathers' ideals and get to use the excuse..."I'm just doing my job?" When have we heard that excuse before?

    I think until we can reign in our politicians, we should have a checklist on our tax returns of all uses of taxpayer dollars so we can allocate where we'd like our money to go!

    Can you imagine how long the list would be of government programs to choose from? It would certainly be more fair and a HUGE wake up call to Americans.

    Thats true, I seen what the IRS is capable of, they DESTROYED my uncle's life because he lost a lot of his paperwork for his small business in a house fire and was unable to contest them when they said he owed over 200,000 dollars in back taxes, WHICH HE DID NOT. After fees and late penalties and interest they tack on he ended up half million in the hole to them, they took his house, his cars, every thing he had of value and left his family with nothing and on the streets. They are ruthles bastards and those who work for them are indeed complicit. That said, the guy Stack killed could have been a mail carrier or some chinese guy delivering their lunch for all he knew, we know now it was indeed an IRS employee but you get my point I am sure.

    In any case, American's need to make a stand against this type of corruption because they have us by the balls and there is no light at the end of the tunnel. I would not wish my worst enemy have the IRS on their ass, its a fucking nightmare for many American's everyday.

    Like I said before though, I am not one of those crazed tax protestor types, I dont mind paying my fair share of taxes when they go to help feed people or build roads or pay the fireman, but I dont like them spending my money on weapons of mass destruction that are used to kill people who pose no threat to our nation.


    Last edited by Paximus on Sat Feb 27, 2010 4:53 am; edited 4 times in total
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    Post by Guest Fri Feb 26, 2010 10:49 pm

    I'm no fan of the IRS, but not everything they do is bad/wrong/criminal. I think to say the employee is "complicit with the corruption" is unfair. How do you know his job wasn't to find mistakes and issue refunds?

    I hope you do not mean to imply that the IRS agent's murder by Mr. Stack was "OK" because of our disagreement with the tax laws.
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    Post by ericclimbs Sat Feb 27, 2010 3:35 am

    From seekingalpha.com
    http://seekingalpha.com/article/189649-wealth-disparities-in-u-s-approaching-1920s-levels?source=from_friend
    snippet:
    "People are starting to "lose" it as a result. This past week's airplane event in Austin was a disturbing development. I must admit that I really am not surprised. The government shouldn't be either.

    Things are only going to get worse in the violence department as the taxpayers continue to get violated and more desperate as a result of this economic cataststrophe. The news media tried to downplay the actions in Austin.

    I think Washington was both surprised and concerned about what took place in Texas.

    I have to ask: Should the government really be surpised that an American flew a plane into an IRS building in a fit of rage as we all get repeatedly fleeced by the political and social elites of this country?

    Let me preface all of this by saying violence is not the answer here. However, why shouldn't every American be infuriated by what has ocurred since this crisis began?"
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    Post by Percy Sat Feb 27, 2010 4:55 am

    The Kay wrote:I'm no fan of the IRS, but not everything they do is bad/wrong/criminal. I think to say the employee is "complicit with the corruption" is unfair. How do you know his job wasn't to find mistakes and issue refunds?

    I hope you do not mean to imply that the IRS agent's murder by Mr. Stack was "OK" because of our disagreement with the tax laws.

    Murder is never ok and voilence is never ok unless it is for purposes of self defense or the defense of another's life in imminent danger so I dont agree with what Stacks did but I can understand what drove him to the point of insanity.
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    Post by Percy Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:00 am

    ericclimbs wrote:From seekingalpha.com
    http://seekingalpha.com/article/189649-wealth-disparities-in-u-s-approaching-1920s-levels?source=from_friend
    snippet:
    "People are starting to "lose" it as a result. This past week's airplane event in Austin was a disturbing development. I must admit that I really am not surprised. The government shouldn't be either.

    Things are only going to get worse in the violence department as the taxpayers continue to get violated and more desperate as a result of this economic cataststrophe. The news media tried to downplay the actions in Austin.

    I think Washington was both surprised and concerned about what took place in Texas.

    I have to ask: Should the government really be surpised that an American flew a plane into an IRS building in a fit of rage as we all get repeatedly fleeced by the political and social elites of this country?

    Let me preface all of this by saying violence is not the answer here. However, why shouldn't every American be infuriated by what has ocurred since this crisis began?"


    I will be completely honest with you and keep in mind that I am not your average doomsdayer who thinks the sky is falling. But I do believe and have many reasons to conclude that things are going to get very bad here in America in the next ten years. I think we are facing an imminent economic collapse/catastrophe and we may all very well see a time where the average person takes to the streets to fight to get his family a loaf of bread, it really is that bad, believe it or not, our economic system can only continue as it is for so long and then its game over. They are trying to keep it going as long as they can but sooner or later it all has to come down like the house of cards that it is. We may or may not live to see this in our lifetime but that outcome is inevitable in my opinion. I study economics, it is sort of a hobby of mine and I can clearly see the writing on the wall, the whole world is in trouble and we are now in the calm before the storm.
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    Post by ziggy Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:58 pm

    I agree Pax - instead of focusing on the right and wrong of the guy's actions, we should be focusing on the parts of our system that are beginning to drive people to do desperate things.

    I think there is a difference between a murderer who simply feels driven to kill from some deviant desire, versus someone who feels so oppressed by their governmental systems or court systems that they feel the only way for their voice to be heard is to spill blood - because let's face it, that DOES get attention.

    I watched the movie "Law Abiding Citizen" last night and I felt for the guy... yet another evil prosecutor movie (ugh).

    I have seen the Family Court system destroy people. I have seen the IRS destroy people. Is that really the function of our government? I hate big government and this "house of cards" economy is just that; built on electronic money, futures etc...it's bound to become "unsustainable" to coin a popular phrase.
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    Post by Percy Sat Feb 27, 2010 3:32 pm

    ziggy wrote:I agree Pax - instead of focusing on the right and wrong of the guy's actions, we should be focusing on the parts of our system that are beginning to drive people to do desperate things.

    I think there is a difference between a murderer who simply feels driven to kill from some deviant desire, versus someone who feels so oppressed by their governmental systems or court systems that they feel the only way for their voice to be heard is to spill blood - because let's face it, that DOES get attention.

    I watched the movie "Law Abiding Citizen" last night and I felt for the guy... yet another evil prosecutor movie (ugh).

    I have seen the Family Court system destroy people. I have seen the IRS destroy people. Is that really the function of our government? I hate big government and this "house of cards" economy is just that; built on electronic money, futures etc...it's bound to become "unsustainable" to coin a popular phrase.

    Very well said. Is that film out on DVD yet or did you go to the theatre? I want to see it for sure.

    We have a fiat monetary system. Fiat works like this; inflate or die. There are no alternatives, thats it and like anything, it can only inflate so much before it pops. Game over. Its coming, make no mistake, I dont know when, I make no predictions, but it will happen sooner or later and I believe possibly in our lifetime, maybe sooner than we all want to admit.
    Another good example of Mr. Stacks is Theodore Kaczynski, I dont like what he did but he felt he had no other options and what he wrote did in fact make sense, in fact everything he wrote is coming true as we speak. Ever read his manifesto? Check it out sometime. He felt he did what he had to do to get people to listen, I can understand that but it is sad he had to resort to killing people, not my style but...

    His writings are here:

    http://www.newshare.com/Newshare/Common/News/manifesto.html


    BTW, I look forward each day to your posts so dont ever stop, I like to hear what you have to say because youre a very informed and intelligent lady and that is something I really appreciate, there is a shortage of that in the world it seems.
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    Post by ziggy Sat Feb 27, 2010 4:22 pm

    Holy Hooded Sweatshirt Batman - I guess I was too impatient to read large volumes in the past (that's what law school will teach you....read, read, read) but I actually now have to admit that Kaczynski is not rambling or insane, in fact I agree with his first section that I've read through.

    I now look forward to reading the rest of it in detail. Thanks a lot Pax; now I have to go around defending the unibomber! (in his ideals only, not his solution).

    I'm totally intrigued now. He's so right about oversocialization - that is why I hate political correctness and trying to force people into thinking the same way through ridicule and shame, the same thing "they" frown upon when it's directed at a protected group. OMG there's just too much to wrap my head around right now, but thanks for sharing that.

    I wish people would read and contemplate these things instead of People magazine. At little celeb. trash is a nice distraction but it's a total junk food diet for the brain = better to eat your junk food than read it, imo.

    And thank you for the compliment. It's been a gift to get to know you and these forum members because I'm growing warp speed ahead...there are no coincidences Smile
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    Post by Percy Sat Feb 27, 2010 4:38 pm

    ziggy wrote:Holy Hooded Sweatshirt Batman - I guess I was too impatient to read large volumes in the past (that's what law school will teach you....read, read, read) but I actually now have to admit that Kaczynski is not rambling or insane, in fact I agree with his first section that I've read through.

    I now look forward to reading the rest of it in detail. Thanks a lot Pax; now I have to go around defending the unibomber! (in his ideals only, not his solution).

    I'm totally intrigued now. He's so right about oversocialization - that is why I hate political correctness and trying to force people into thinking the same way through ridicule and shame, the same thing "they" frown upon when it's directed at a protected group. OMG there's just too much to wrap my head around right now, but thanks for sharing that.

    I wish people would read and contemplate these things instead of People magazine. At little celeb. trash is a nice distraction but it's a total junk food diet for the brain = better to eat your junk food than read it, imo.

    And thank you for the compliment. It's been a gift to get to know you and these forum members because I'm growing warp speed ahead...there are no coincidences The Manifesto of Joe Stacks (IRS BUILDING PLANE CRASH DUDE) Icon_smile


    He is mentally ill as fuck but he makes damned good sense and is clearly a genius and way before his time. Which reminds me in the science and tech forum I started a thread on the connection between genius and mental illness another great topic of interest!

    Def read the rest of his writing, he really makes a stong case and nobody paid any attention to him but at Mich State university they have a class that is all about that manifesto and they also have all of his original writings in the library there, they paid for the rights to them and teach classes about him and not in a bad way, he simply makes sense and a few people are starting to see that.
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    Post by Percy Sat Feb 27, 2010 4:45 pm

    Ziggy I also wanted to mention that it is now a known and documented fact that Teddy was a subject of mind control experimentation in the 60s at University of California, Berkeley.

    They talk about this in the classes they teach at Mich State about him, so maybe the fact that he did what he did was to discredit people like him altogether if you catch my drift.

    This isnt a conspiracy its a fact, he was indeed part of such a program.

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